GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Talk about Petra albums, songs, and concerts.
Post Reply
User avatar
rexreed
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 977
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:21 pm
#1 Album: Beyond Belief
Pethead since: 1991
Location: Houston
x 34

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by rexreed » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:33 pm

You know what? I like Greg and John, too. I don't like all the assumptions on the past few pages. So what if Greg sang Zepplin? You want to disect the lyrics 40 years later go ahead. While you are at it be sure and diagram the lyrics to "Ring around the Rosy." As for his daughters dresses, sure they are short, but I've seen shorter and in the setting they fit in just fine. I don't consider them sleazy, maybe some of you do? Prove that it is, you probably can't. The dancing? Well, some folks don't believe anyone should dance, ever, and others 2 step every chance they get! I saw some performers doing your typical rock jam- so?!?!?! And I have a daughter too. If I get to take the stage w/ her all 'll be able to contribute will be lousy trombone playing:)

As for John and Head East- I'm w/ Brent here. Those are some killer tunes that he sang! Shoot, maybe one daya secular band would play a Petra tune?
0 x

Preacherman777
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 1116
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2003 2:10 pm
Location: Northern Minnesota
x 2
Contact:

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by Preacherman777 » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:38 pm

Christians love to pick other Christians apart. It's the Pharisee syndrome.
0 x
If you like Petra you might like my music. You can download it free.

http://www.godlychristianmusic.com/Musi ... &name=Mike and Martha Tifft

Dev
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:53 pm
#1 Album: More Power To Ya
Pethead since: 1981

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by Dev » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:06 pm

I'm not offended by either Greg or John and I find those of you who are outraged by Greg just plain silly. How is getting up and singing one song you didn't even write worse than choosing to "commerate" the songs you wrote that glorify your years as a drunk and a drug addict?

Personally, I think both men could have made better choices, considering both of them are God-loving ministers who've spent the last 25 years spreading the Gospel and trying to get people to put their eyes on Jesus and not on the world. But since they didn't, I'll see it for what it is--a couple of older dudes letting loose and enjoying the moment with a few good tunes that happened to have raunchy lyrics.

Hopefully, they'll both pick cleaner songs next time.
0 x

fcollazo
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 721
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2003 5:55 pm
x 39

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by fcollazo » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:40 pm

Great common sense by Dev. That's excactly how I feel about this.

If the chuirch would concentrate more on reaching the lost, feeding the hungry, clothing and sheltering the homeless and loving thier neighbors, instead of worrying about how someone dresses, wears their hair, wether a person dances or sings non-Christian music, God's will would be done on Earth.

People, not doing these things will never get you into heaven. I you believe this you are living a legalistic fairy dream. You can only be saved by grace and grace alone, so that no one exalts themselves, so the Bible says. Read your Bibles, not men's rules.

My 50 cents...
0 x
God's love hit's me where i live, in my perfect world, because i love the Lord.

Preacherman777
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 1116
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2003 2:10 pm
Location: Northern Minnesota
x 2
Contact:

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by Preacherman777 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 7:53 am

Some good common sense in the last couple of posts.
0 x
If you like Petra you might like my music. You can download it free.

http://www.godlychristianmusic.com/Musi ... &name=Mike and Martha Tifft

stsmedia
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 37
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 5:33 pm
#1 Album: More Power to Ya
Pethead since: 1983
x 2

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by stsmedia » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:29 am

I've got to agree. Been following this whole discussion since my original post, thinking through where/when to jump back in. But the last few posts here really nailed it.
0 x

mikey32187
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:15 pm

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by mikey32187 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:15 am

gman wrote:Breaking news: The Apostle Paul was a pharisee. In fact he went a step further. Not only did he call brothers out, he demanded they get their act together. Guess we gotta throw away the bible.
Side note: who called out Greg or demanded anything from him? I missed that. This is a discussion about what's appropriate as a Christian. Greg and Co. just happen to be the one's that out the example on the table.
Gman, that is the problem in this happy go lucky, modern warm and fuzzy Christian age, anyone who even dares to question something or point out that something looks a little odd, you get thrown to the wolves and accused of being judgmental when all you are doing is sitting back and analyzing something that looks a little out of place and odd.

I even had to make a disclaimer on my post stating adamantly stating that I wasn't judging anyone because there was a possibility that someone would get all bent out of shape. What I see here is not judgement but confusion and a little concern because we all know how dedicated and uncompromising the guys of Petra are. If it were anyone else I wouldn't even bat an eye because CCM has gotten so worldly. It's merely shock, not judgement. I wish the the modern church would man up and get a grip.

To be honest most of us wouldn't have lasted in Apostle's Paul's day we would get mad and leave the church at the mere thought of him being blunt

And btw I couldn't help but notice the short skirt I am a man after all. men do have a tendency to look from time to time you know :lol:
0 x
Faith is our belief in God, doctrine is what we believe about God

gman
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 1111
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:03 am
Location: Used to be Grand Rapids, MI after leaving the beautiful beaches of NJ. Now it's PA.
x 33
Contact:

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by gman » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:22 am

I don't attend a legalistic church, and I didn't grow up in one. I think on most things, the church should be silent. But, they shouldn't have zero standards. In regards to modesty, which is where some folks went with the video, there is such a thing as too much skin. Paul talked about not causing a brother to stumble. He also set precedent for sorting things out in the church so as not to hinder the gospel or the work of the church. I'll give a specific example. A tall female shows up to church repeatedly wearing skirts that would be quite short on a short person, and then as leader of a church function, shows up at said function wearing what amounts to Daisy Dukes. In a case like that, I think there is justification for a private conversation with the individual. Not causing a brother to stumble applies. The image of the church is to be considered.
As for things like smoking, drinking, dancing, length of hair, style of dress, jeans, preacher not wearing a tie, etc. All the things typically associated with a legalistic church. If I were a pastor, and people in my congregation started going down that road and complaining about such things, I would say to them, go find another church because we don't play that here.
As for the video, it was the modesty thing, and the saxual nature of it that raised some eyebrows. If I were a pastor and they attended my church, I would probably let it go and move along. One of my jobs is to give them the tools to make good decisions, but it's not my role to police their decisions. If they are serving in my church in a leadership or teaching role, then maybe we have an issue. If it's a one time thing, we discuss it briefly as a poor choice and move along. If it's something that they do regularly, then I think there is justification to address it further. Again, because of the modesty and saxual issues.
This is all speaking in hypothetical terms though. We don't have context on the video beyond what is in it, so we express disappointment in what we see, and that it might not be the best choice, and we move along.
I'm not interested in calling out Greg or his family, but I did think this was a good discussion because it brought up the larger point of what standards should we have, what standards should a church have, and what is or isn't legalistic. And we all differ on that. As a guy I definitely want every attractive woman in the church to show up on sunday morning dressed like the women in the video. As a christian I say that would be a problem. I personally believe that a church should maintain the standard that it's generally not appropriate to come to church like that.
0 x

Dev
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:53 pm
#1 Album: More Power To Ya
Pethead since: 1981

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by Dev » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:29 am

Hey Mikey,

I don't see a problem with calling things like you see 'em. My problem with the discussion of this thread is that both men, who I believe are good and godly, were in virtually the same situation, but only one was getting condemnation, while the other was getting excuses made for him. As I pointed out in my post, I just don't see any difference between what either of them did. They both got up and sang songs that were fairly inappropriate given the content and the testimony of their lives, but I don't think it's so serious that either of them should be called on the carpet.

Now, if it became a regular habit for either one of them, I might think differently. :-)
0 x

executioner
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 3947
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:56 am
#1 Album: JAH
Pethead since: 1980
Location: Earth
x 56

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by executioner » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:34 am

I'm sick of the fuzzy wuzzy Christianity that some on this topic are promoting; I swear we've all been transported to a Joel Osteen Love Conference. This "don't rock the boat Christianity" is the exact thing Christ spoke out against in Scripture and also Christ also preached about how we should as Christians speak out against sin especially towards other believers and should never be in the way of someone following Christ.

After watching both videos and looking at the lyrics of both songs I've come to the reasoning that both videos are tasteless(John's to a lesser degree because there are no women suggestively dancing with their legs showing in his video)BTW in John's video unless someone knew the lyrics in would be ok because too be honest I couldn't understand most of the words John was singing.

In the reformation of Classic Petra Greg has really been upfront and open about how he is a minister for the faith; did anyone see a "minister of the Faith" up there on that stage? Were there any seeds planted for the Kingdom of God because of it? NO is the answer to both of these. Could these videos be a block to present the Gospel and to allow a Believer to fall into sin? YES is the answer to both of these.

I'm sorry but my final assessment is that both videos are not right and hopefully will not be promoted by anyone from themselves or fans like us.
0 x
FORGIVE! FORGET! & LET GO!

Dev
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:53 pm
#1 Album: More Power To Ya
Pethead since: 1981

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by Dev » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:37 am

gman wrote: Not causing a brother to stumble applies.

***Gman, I totally get where you're coming from and I appreciate the spirit behind it. Guys always seem to bring up a woman's clothes and say it isn't modest enough, etc. Which in this day and age is fair given the immodesty everywhere.

However, I would like to mention that as a person with a niece who's life has been ravaged by drugs and alcohol because she's just havin' a good time, the subject of glorifying drugs and alcohol might hit some people harder then the length of someone's dress.

Considering the appropriate length of someone's dress is subjective, while the pitfalls of drugs are well documented, I'll stand by my original post and say both men engaged in behavior that might seem inappropriate to someone.
Last edited by Dev on Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 x

executioner
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 3947
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:56 am
#1 Album: JAH
Pethead since: 1980
Location: Earth
x 56

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by executioner » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:40 am

Dev wrote:Hey Mikey,

I don't see a problem with calling things like you see 'em. My problem with the discussion of this thread is that both men, who I believe are good and godly, were in virtually the same situation, but only one was getting condemnation, while the other was getting excuses made for him. As I pointed out in my post, I just don't see any difference between what either of them did. They both got up and sang songs that were fairly inappropriate given the content and the testimony of their lives, but I don't think it's so serious that either of them should be called on the carpet.

Now, if it became a regular habit for either one of them, I might think differently. :-)

Even a one time thing like these videos were could cause a Christian to stumble so how much more right can a "one time thing" over something that could continue be? I see there is no grey area here, but see so many are trying to justify the wrongs even though they most likely are a one time thing.
0 x
FORGIVE! FORGET! & LET GO!

mikey32187
Pethead
Pethead
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:15 pm

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by mikey32187 » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:44 am

Dev wrote:Hey Mikey,

I don't see a problem with calling things like you see 'em. My problem with the discussion of this thread is that both men, who I believe are good and godly, were in virtually the same situation, but only one was getting condemnation, while the other was getting excuses made for him. As I pointed out in my post, I just don't see any difference between what either of them did. They both got up and sang songs that were fairly inappropriate given the content and the testimony of their lives, but I don't think it's so serious that either of them should be called on the carpet.

Now, if it became a regular habit for either one of them, I might think differently. :-)
I do question both decisions and my mind went back to the Head East thing, however I do appreciate Sue's post about the major thought that John put into deciding to participate in the event. I was shocked when I saw John's and now Greg's. Those guys are solid Christians, and like I said I was just shocked and taken aback, precisely because of their history as Christians and members of an uncompromising Christian band. I am not judging them in any ways shape or form but I felt that they were out of place in those environments.

If anything I should think this thread is a testament to their strong faith because we recognize as fans that they are solid Christians and we are just surprised by the circumstances is all.

If it were on any other less committed band's forum their wouldn't even be this discussion because this would be common place for some other bands or member's of said band. Do you think they are having these discussions on Stryper forums? No, because Stryper is the kind of band that would relish the opportunity to do this kind of thing, heck they even made a compilation album of covers of secular music.

Contextually speaking I have more understanding of why John did what he did over Greg.
0 x
Faith is our belief in God, doctrine is what we believe about God

gman
Pethead Fanatic
Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 1111
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:03 am
Location: Used to be Grand Rapids, MI after leaving the beautiful beaches of NJ. Now it's PA.
x 33
Contact:

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by gman » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:13 pm

mikey32187 wrote:
Dev wrote:Hey Mikey,

I don't see a problem with calling things like you see 'em. My problem with the discussion of this thread is that both men, who I believe are good and godly, were in virtually the same situation, but only one was getting condemnation, while the other was getting excuses made for him. As I pointed out in my post, I just don't see any difference between what either of them did. They both got up and sang songs that were fairly inappropriate given the content and the testimony of their lives, but I don't think it's so serious that either of them should be called on the carpet.

Now, if it became a regular habit for either one of them, I might think differently. :-)
I do question both decisions and my mind went back to the Head East thing, however I do appreciate Sue's post about the major thought that John put into deciding to participate in the event. I was shocked when I saw John's and now Greg's. Those guys are solid Christians, and like I said I was just shocked and taken aback, precisely because of their history as Christians and members of an uncompromising Christian band. I am not judging them in any ways shape or form but I felt that they were out of place in those environments.

If anything I should think this thread is a testament to their strong faith because we recognize as fans that they are solid Christians and we are just surprised by the circumstances is all.

If it were on any other less committed band's forum their wouldn't even be this discussion because this would be common place for some other bands or member's of said band. Do you think they are having these discussions on Stryper forums? No, because Stryper is the kind of band that would relish the opportunity to do this kind of thing, heck they even made a compilation album of covers of secular music.

Contextually speaking I have more understanding of why John did what he did over Greg.
Stryper is not who they once were, at least not all the guys, but you make a good point. How many so called Christian bands or bands of faith could we name that could do something similar, and we wouldn't think much of it.
0 x

executioner
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Extreme Pethead Fanatic
Posts: 3947
Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 10:56 am
#1 Album: JAH
Pethead since: 1980
Location: Earth
x 56

Re: GXV recent solo performance w/Louie

Post by executioner » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:29 pm

I was talking to my accountability partner from church about this(looking for insight from an outside Godly person) and showed him the topic and videos, and something that he raised up was we are all looking at these from the wrong perspective. He said go back to both videos and instead of looking for what is wrong with the videos look and see if you can find anything right or Godly in them, and looking from that angle I could tell that there is nothing right or Godly pertaining to the videos, so he asked me as Christians do you think God wanted them up there on that stage doing what they were doing? My answer was no because I couldn't find a faith based reason why a Christian should be there. I just thought his perspective and outlook was different and also opened my eyes and heart to what is right/wrong about this.
0 x
FORGIVE! FORGET! & LET GO!

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 54 guests