I really miss Petra

Talk about Petra albums, songs, and concerts.
brent
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Post by brent » Mon Apr 27, 2009 2:36 pm

Brian came to the church that I used to work for here in Kansas.

His testimony and salvation experience seemed rock solid at the time. He was cutting himself off from KORN, but he was still friends with the guys he said. He mentioned that a couple of the guys in KORN also had made a decision to accept Christ, but were still going to keep the band going. Brian said at that time that he was going to work on his music, which would be hard, and that he would not give in and change his appearance and musical style as some Christian publishers wanted him to do.

On the Johnny Dare radio show, Brian was asked why he didn't just stick with KORN and try to be a witness to others. Brian said that he didn't feel right doing it at that time, but who knows what the future holds.

I don't know the guy or the hell for life he has had and is still reaping. I do know that he cares for the people around him, but think he was in protection mode at that time until he could handle it. He said he had anything he wanted any time. So he was not strong enough to be in that lifestyle.

I hardly think that being active on a forum is backing out of his commitment to Christ. We all slip and fall and he will. We don't know what God can be doing behind the scenes. Being available to speak to people on a forum can be a good ministry opportunity.
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Post by petrabandca » Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:53 pm

I completely agree with you Brent.
I'm glad that he continues to keep in touch with his Korn fans and the members of the band. Fans are a powerful group and you can't just turn your back on them, especially teenagers who literally adore you, idolize you and grow up with your music.

It's great, because Brian can now come down from that rock star pedestal that fans have put him on and really connect with kids who want to talk with him. I was in awe when I first met Petra and John Schlitt was so welcoming. I was a star struck fan that night and left as a friend.

Too many labels, expectations and inward finger pointing in my personal opinion.

I listen to music from Metallica and Kid Rock to Petra and Stryper to Brad Paisley and Kenny Chesney...I just love music. I even like Nicelback, sorry Brent...a little Canadian pride ;-)
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Post by Vic » Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:04 am

brent wrote:Vic. You could always order the CDs online, or have someone here send them to you.


Thanks. I have visa cards but for some reason all music sites I've tried to purchase from could not allow me to purchase coz of my location. All of them serve their own countries e.g. Amazon -US. Any way, there's a friend of mine studying theology in the US who is purchasing on my behalf. Should he not succeed, I'll need your help.

There is one thing that both music and preaching share:- When a musician or preacher gets famous they often lose genuine fellowship with honest friends who can speak into their lives and keep them accountable, and that's where most of them get lost.

This may be unintentional coz even good friends or even mentors can turn into sycophants and forget that a musician also has a soul too. The loneliness and the pressures that face these two careers is so much (though it is not an excuse) and eventually many crack.

However, it is the personal responsibility for all of us to seek and give honest friendship and mentorship to and from others.
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Post by sue d. » Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:36 am

Vic, you're partially right - and I'd like to add something.

I think too, that when many musicians become 'famous' the new people who approach them as friends are in reality just trying to USE them for their own personal gain. They pretend to BE a friend, but they're really just trying to make connections and climb the ladder.

At first you don't realize this, but as time goes by and you see the so-called friends come & go - you figure out what's really going on.

So now the famous person is suspicious of EVERYONE who wants to be a friend because he really doesn't know if the person is sincere, or just a ladder climber.

Now he isolates himself and goes into self-protection mode.... with lots of acquaintances but very few friends. At least that's how I see it.
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Post by Kirkman » Sat May 02, 2009 7:58 pm

brent wrote:1. Ska sucks
2. Christian Ska REALLY sucked
3. I am glad it's dead.
4. FIF is dead THANK GOD
5. If you look on that intelligence/music scale, people with little intel like Ska. Sorry. Just the way it is.
Yikes, Brent. I always liked to think of myself as somewhat intelligent. I guess now I know better.

Seriously, Five Iron Frenzy was a great band. They wrote strong Christian lyrics in some songs, they tackled weighty issues like the U.S. injustices against Indians or greed in capitalism, and they also just goofed off.

I almost went to their farewell concert... but a little thing called marriage intervened.
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Post by brent » Sat May 02, 2009 11:15 pm

Hey. Long time no see.

It's all in fun. did you see that chart I am talking about? Christian music didn't do so well.
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Post by separateunion » Sun May 03, 2009 2:49 am

I was lucky enough to see Five Iron play in Green Bay, WI exactly two weeks before their final concert. I knew someone who had a ticket to the final show, but even if I could have found a ticket for sale, I couldn't afford it nor the plane ticket (or any other financial obligations incurred from such a trip). Thankfully, the final concert was released on CD, and there are persistent rumors about a Five Iron DVD with footage from that concert.
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Post by Tutor_23 » Mon May 04, 2009 10:00 am

How about the Canadian band Hawk Nelson? The most confrontational message they line I heard at one of their recent concerts was, "Stay in school."

I sat there in incredulity, thinking, "Is that all you've got!? How lame!" Contrast that with the straight forward, no compromise message of Petra over the years.

The words "tepid", "diluted", etc. come to mind.
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Post by separateunion » Mon May 04, 2009 10:01 am

Tutor_23 wrote:How about the Canadian band Hawk Nelson? The most confrontational message they line I heard at one of their recent concerts was, "Stay in school."

I sat there in incredulity, thinking, "Is that all you've got!? How lame!" Contrast that with the straight forward, no compromise message of Petra over the years.

The words "tepid", "diluted", etc. come to mind.
Most people I know hate Hawk Nelson.
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Post by Ange » Tue May 05, 2009 6:22 pm

Anytime there is a disagreement about what is acceptable as a Christian to do or not to do, we should always go the God's Word for clarification.

Here's just a few verses I found on the subject:

"But if I say, 'I will not mention him or speak any more in his name,' his word is in my heart like a fire, a fire shut up in my bones. I am weary of holding it in; indeed, I cannot." Jeremiah 20:9

"The mouth speaks about what overflows from the heart."
Matthew 12:34

"But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart."
Matthew 15:18

"Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravaging wolves. You'll recognize them by their fruit. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes or figs from thistles? In the same way, every good tree produces good fruit, but a bad tree produces bad fruit. A good tree can't produce bad fruit; neither can a bad tree produce good fruit. Every tree that doesn't produce good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So you'll recognize them by their fruit. Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord!' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but [only] the one who does the will of My Father in heaven."
Matthew 7:15-21

"What goes into a man's mouth does not make him 'unclean', but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him 'unclean'."
Matthew 15:11

"Then he called the crowd to him along with his disciples and said: If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me."
Mark 8:34

"How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can they preach unless they are sent? As it is written, How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!"
Romans 10:14-15

"I pray that you may be active in sharing your faith, so that you will have a full understanding of every good thing we have in Christ."
Philemon 1:4

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."
Matthew 28:19-20


There are many people who don't like to talk about living truly repentant lives and daily sacrificing their wants/needs for the glory of God. Maybe it makes them uncomfortable. Maybe it makes them feel convicted. I really don't know. I just know that I cannot help but to proclaim what is in my heart on a regular basis. Your occupation does not matter. We have all been called to The Great Commission. Let's all do our part!

"May the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep, equip you with everything good for doing His will, and may He work in us what is pleasing to Him through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen!"
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Post by brent » Tue May 05, 2009 9:13 pm

I think you are confusing bands getting paid money to perform with Christians and their personal responsibility to be the hands and feet of Christ.

If we say that Christians should be Christians singing to Christians, then we will have it turning into the self-serving in-church entertainment that people say that it is. If we say that it should be evangelistic to the world, as WE are in the world daily, then we run the risk of hearing people say that Christian bands are selling out to get into secular venues.

The list of Christian bands drawing worldly listeners willing to pay money to be preached at is VERY short.
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Post by separateunion » Wed May 06, 2009 5:55 am

Ange wrote:I just know that I cannot help but to proclaim what is in my heart on a regular basis. Your occupation does not matter. We have all been called to The Great Commission. Let's all do our part!
Not discounting your verses, but this part stuck out to me. What exactly is your job? How do you share the gospel within your sphere of work? What are people to do in jobs where on the job preaching is strictly prohibited?
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Post by brent » Wed May 06, 2009 6:52 am

separateunion wrote:
Ange wrote:I just know that I cannot help but to proclaim what is in my heart on a regular basis. Your occupation does not matter. We have all been called to The Great Commission. Let's all do our part!
Not discounting your verses, but this part stuck out to me. What exactly is your job? How do you share the gospel within your sphere of work? What are people to do in jobs where on the job preaching is strictly prohibited?
Amen. If all of the talking heads on your fav news station were Christian, how would you get the traffic, weather and sports? They would only be able to speak to Christians and talk about Christian things? Man that is NOT what the bible tells us to be like.

Be IN the world, not OF the world.

There are many verses in the bible that mention music and instruments. The purposes for music are many. They are not limited to singing TO Christians. They include singing to God, singing to people about God, singing to one's self about their situation, waking up in the morning, going to bed, entertainment, leading armies to battles, winning a battle, etc. In all instances, Christians and non-Christians were involved.

There is no biblical standard for music, though some nut job preachers have made money on the subject. We CAN see that happy music was played when people were happy. Sad music was played when people are sad (so much for the legalistic morons that say the blues are satanic). While in captivity no Isrealite played music at all. They rocked it and danced when free. When Jesus was crucified they began using minors, playing the blues (their way).

All of the CCM bands that we all know, who have released product to the masses, did so commercially. They used commerce. It's a music BUSINESS. It's a way to make money. Nobody is in it for nothing. There is some kind of payoff.

Music is nothing more than advertising. Songs are written and packaged to reach a target audience, so that people will buy PRODUCT. Radio, TV, movies, games, etc all use music to cross pollenate and generate more SALES. This hyper niche marketing is what dictates the content at times.

Some tend to over spiritualize the process and place more importance on CCM than it deserves. It is a PRODUCT. It is PROGRAM MATERIAL. It makes money for people. The only people worried about the art, the message, impact and results are the artists themselves. Sometimes that isn't even true for them.

Look. We here, the very small number of people that we are, do not agree on what the bible says. Some of us do not agree on what Salvation is or on how one gets it, if one has a choice. So multiply that times a million.
Now, these million people do not like the same type of music. Some like rock, some country, some jazz, some blues, etc. This is natural. Music appeals to individuals for various reasons. This the Christian market. Now then, try to write some lyrics that a million people will agree with, and music that everyone will listen to. You get what we have in CCM. It sucks most of the time and it doesn't work to bring in the world.

Christian music is laughed at by producers, engineers and industry folk on some of the largest recording industry boards. It is not laughed at for it's lyrical content per se. It is not respected because it is such a homogenized, soul-less, artistically deprived music. Peopple spend their time trying to copy secular sounds of the past. It is right up there with pop country in their opinions. SUPER formatted and predictable. Then we have the nice Christian testimonies of company execs, producers and musicians not paying bills to deal with.

Some bands do not want to be confined to playing this narrow niched format that chokes creativity and expression. They want to play more than the three chorded U2-ified light punk. They do not want to have their income capped. Heck, they would like to HAVE an income. They find it more fulfilling to find ways to sing Christian things, in non-christian venues, to non-christian audiences, etc. Some of them just live like an open book, playing secular music. I cannot blame them. Most of Christian music sucks!
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Post by Ange » Wed May 06, 2009 12:26 pm

It's amazing to me the excuses people will use as to why they do not share their faith. I have friends that are missionaries that live among people that not only lose their jobs for their faith, but even their very lives. If you lost your job because you shared your faith with someone, do you really think God would just abandon you? He is our provider. Should you make sure you witness at the right time and in the right way? Of course! As a nurse, it would be foolish for me to try and force a patient to talk about their feelings about God if they were uncomfortable doing so. However, when I see a patient that is having trouble coping with their illness or disability, it is an honor to be able to show them how to have true hope and the peace that passes all understanding through repentance and a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Do all my nurse managers and coworkers agree with me? No. Do they say things that imply I should stop? Yes. But what does my Lord (who is my ultimate example) say? Did He water down the gospel when He was persecuted? What about Peter, Paul, Timothy, and the eleven disciples that were martyred for their faith? Were they worried that the comforts in life that they had grown accustomed to might be taken away? Praise be to God that they didn't!

I'm sorry that I did not make myself clear on the subject of traffic, weather and sports. First, we have to remember that being a Christian is not something we are or something we do at particular times, it is what we are 24/7. It is not something we turn off and on depending on who's around or what we are doing at the time. If I was reporting the traffic and a major accident had just happened and I felt like saying the people involved in the accident could use our prayers, then I should not feel embarrassed, ashamed or threatened to say so. Can I give a traffic report without talking about God? Of course! Do I have everyday conversations with people, saved and unsaved alike, about things like furniture, vacation places, silly things our grandkids do and so on? Of course! But do I keep silent when something having to do with my Christian walk comes up? Absolutely not! How will they hear if we do not tell them?

NOTHING should stand between us and our witness for Christ! I am sure that I am much older than most of you on here, and I believe that with more life experience, you will find this to be true also. No job, no relationship, no amount of money, no worldly reputation, absolutely nothing is more important than sharing the gospel with a lost and dying world.

I think that is what it basically comes down to. If you truly believe that your coworkers will be seperated from God for eternity and you choose not to tell them for fear of losing your position or income, then what are your priorities? You are right, it is so true that we are in the world and are not of the world. (“If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you. Remember the word that I said to you, ‘A slave is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you.") We are a strange and a peculiar people. Weird enough to lose our jobs, and even possibly our lives, over our faith.

But, as far as a Christian singing in a secular band for money goes. I have a dear Christian friend that does that every weekend. However, she uses every opportunity she gets, which is very often, to share her faith both onstage and before and after shows. And I'm not talking about a simple, "I want to thank Jesus Christ for this award" kind of stuff. She gets down to the nitty gritty of repentance, which is a subject most Christians don't even like discussing. I also have another friend that is in a secular band that calls himself a Christian on Sundays, but the "fruit" of his life does not show it on the other days of the week. No one who sees him play would ever have a clue that he even calls himself a Christian. No one is going to come to the saving knowledge of Jesus Christ through his music or through his message. To me, that is the difference.

I don't understand how watering down the message is more evangelistic than telling it completely with all you've got. More people may here what you've got to say, but what are you saying? Some good examples of that are Creed and Evanesence. They've done more to discredit the gospel than to lead people to Christ.

As far as style goes, that is completely irrelevant.

I have enjoyed reading everyone's comments not only on this subject, but on so many others. I miss Petra too and, like the first poster said, it was their straight forward message with a rockin' sound that was so awesome. One without the other just wouldn't have been the same!

May God bless each of you!
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Post by brent » Wed May 06, 2009 4:10 pm

You are making some huge assumptions. You are assuming that these artists in question do not share their faith off stage. Some of the people that I know of do not have speaking or singing positions on stage. It is not their place. So they are off the hook. But even those that do sing...you are not considering the other 23 hours of the day that they are living. With all due respect, you have no idea who these people really are, or who they talk to behind closed doors. You have not been around them to know. So really, I mean this in the most Christian way, you proof that anyone is using an excuse.

I would venture to say most people do not REALLY know their pastor, and they have TONS of exposure time with him. Lots of people around here didn't know a pastor that was having sex with teenage boys. There was a pastor in TN that was convicted of the same thing. Yeah. We are all worried about musicians in bands (which are NOT part of the church) when the people in charge of the church are screwing it sexually, monetarilly, etc.

Consider John Elefonte. He was a believer when he sang for Kansas. Kansas had some Christian thoughts and concepts in their tunes. They never came out and gave Kerry Livgren a pulpit to preach from. Had they, the crowds would have left. Instead he fed them bits and pieces that they could handle. John and Kerry have had bible studies for Christians and non-christians to attend. They have witnessed to and led many to the Lord. These are just a couple of examples.

I know of a drummer that plays for a band that EVERYONE knows. This drummer was an addict. He became a Christian, quit the drugs and booze and still plays. He is living out his walk in front of people that the average Joe Boo could not reach. We have to reach the world from the inside out, starting where we are. We don't just quit our family, parents, children, friends, etc. We get them to know God.

It is understood that you do not fully comprehend my last post. You have a simplistic point of view where everything is black and white and easier said than done. You are not grasping the concept of Christians providing music to the world:

"How can we get people to buy something that they are opposed to and do not want to hear, when they could go buy something they want to hear?"
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